Drugs chat with Ruth from DrugScope
Ruth Goldsmith from DrugScope drops in to answer your questions on mephedrone, cannabis, digital drugs, antidepressants and more.
**helen**: OK, so let's start with a topic that Teagan has raised on the drugs forum.
Teagan: The technology magazine Wired recently published an article about digital drugs - mp3s that induce a state of ecstasy. Apparently this isn't anything new but people are still discovering them. What do you think of them? Are they popular and what are the effects?
Ruth: Hi Teagan, that's a very good question, unfortunately you've stumped me a bit! I haven't heard much about digital drugs but I'll see what I can find out for you. It's not something we've come across at DrugScope.
From what I can see, what's most likely is that people using digital drugs are actually experiencing a placebo effect. They might be listening to digital music with certain types of beat, which could give you a perception of an altered state of mind. However, it doesn't seem as though there's much difference between this type of sound and for example some types of trance music.
rob: I just wanted to know your opinion on the influx of research chemicals coming into the UK. Every time one gets banned another two take its place, they are so accessible to people. Do we need tighter controls over what we allow in the country or should the drugs advisory council work faster? Also, do you think it's as big a problem as the media makes out?
Ruth: Thanks for your question rob. You're absolutely right, since 2009 there has been a significant change in the drug market in the UK since the arrival of mephedrone and its related substances, things like methylone, methadrone and others. It's very hard for the authorities to manage this situation because of the speed with which suppliers are creating new chemicals.
However, the Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs (ACMD) need time to assess the risks posed by each group of substances. They have worked very quickly to ban naphyrone for example.
rob: Yeah, I was impressed by that, but now theres NRG2 and NRG3 and loads of others. It's going to be hard to keep up.
Ruth: I think you're right. In terms of your question about how the media reacts, it's always interesting to watch how the media respond to a new drug scare. However, there are very real concerns about the risk posed by research chemicals because we know so little about them, their short and long term health risks and, what's even scarier, is that you don't always know what you're buying, because labelling may be inaccurate.
rob: I agree totally.
Ruth: You're also right about NRG2 and NRG3 but I would highlight that many of the samples of NRG1 that were tested recently were found to be mephedrone and not naphyrone. This means that you could be buying something that you think is still legal but is now in fact a controlled substance. For a long time, we've said to people who use legal highs that just because something is legal doesn't mean it's safe. And nowadays we need to add that just because you think what you are buying is legal, it doesn't mean it's actually legal. You might be buying something that has a label on it saying one thing, when really, it contains something completely different.
rob: Prohibition didn't work with alcohol, do you not think it would be better to control these substances and educate people when they buy them like the smart shops in Amsterdam? People will always look for a way to get high, it needs to be controlled and just seems so out of control at the moment.
Ruth: I'm speaking on behalf of DrugScope here and we are not a pro-legalisation organisation. However, that doesn't mean we think that there is not room for improvement in the way we deal with the control of drugs.
purplestarfish: What's the deal with cannabis and mental health? There's so much contradictory stuff around.
Ruth: Hi purplestarfish, you're right there is a lot of contradictory stuff around and so far there is no definitive answer to your question. Our advice to everyone is to be careful with cannabis particularly if you are using it heavily and regularly.
People who have existing mental health problems may find that cannabis makes things worse, and there does seem to be some evidence to suggest that for some people cannabis can trigger underlying mental health issues such as psychosis or depression.
purplestarfish: OK then, thanks.
Ruth: If you're concerned about your own or someone elses cannabis use you can find some good online resources to help you manage coming off cannabis, for example on TheSite.org or via Talk to Frank which has a good online programme that you can follow.
purplestarfish: Cool, thanks for that.
Ruth: Does that answer your question purplestarfish?
purplestarfish: Yes.
Dr Pirate: I've not checked on Talk to Frank recently, as I usually use TheSite.org for any drug research, but the "drugs are bad, mmkay" message that was on there when they first launched really deterred me from using that service.
The Captain: So, is Mr Mackay right?
Ruth: Who's Mr Mackay? Are you talking about the guy from South Park?
The Captain: Yup!
Ruth: Well, in answer to your question then, drugs are drugs, it's what you do with them that's important. DrugScope's position is that we neither condemn nor condone drug use.
The Captain: Fair play. Also, is ecstasy more or less dangerous than horse riding? :)
"People who have existing mental health problems may find that cannabis makes things worse, and there does seem to be some evidence to suggest that for some people cannabis can trigger underlying mental health issues such as psychosis or depression."
Ruth: So, you've been reading some of Professor Nutts research!
Dr Pirate: I guess that depends on how wild the horse is and how much MDMA you've taken!
Ruth: You can look at this question two ways. You can take the Disraeli position, which is: "Lies, damned lies, and statistics" - i.e. numbers can be used to justify almost any position you choose. Or you can look at it in the way that Professor Nutt has done in some of his research - in terms of raw numbers, it may be true that more people die in the UK each year as a result of riding horses than as a result of taking ecstasy. However this doesn't mean that taking ecstasy is safe.
**helen**: Thanks Ruth. Any more questions guys?
rob: I'm usually quite a quiet person. I read somewhere that diazepam can help social anxiety so I bought some off the net. It really has helped me loads, I feel more confident when talking to people and feel like myself. The problem is I've found I'm taking more and more a day. Is it possible to get addicted to diazepam and if so is it dangerous?
Ruth: Hi rob, I'm sorry to hear that you're having problems with diazepam. It's quite important that you go and see somebody you trust and talk to them about your use of diazepam, ideally your GP.
Diazepam, like other benzodiazepines, is prescribed for people who experience feelings of anxiety or insomnia but they should only be used for a short time. If you have been using them for a long time you may find that you have developed a tolerence to the drugs so you may be tempted to take more to get the same effect.
It is possible to become dependent on these drugs and you should not attempt to stop taking them without medical support. Your GP will keep issues like this confidential and should be able to recommend appropriate sources of support for you. He or she should also help you taper down the dose slowly which will help you come off more easily.
I'm sorry to say that buying your diazepam online is not a great idea. It's possible that you may be buying counterfeit medication, which carries an added risk of contamination or of varying strength.
You can go to the DrugScope website for more info and I have a couple of other useful links: this factsheet on Benzodiazepines and the CITAP website (Council for Information on Tranquillisers, Antidepressants, and Painkillers).
rob: Thanks Ruth, I'll check them out.
Dr Pirate: I was reading on Talk to Frank that "over 200 people" have died due to ecstasy overdoses. How can this be a banned substance, when booze and cigarettes kill thousands every month/year? It's perplexing!
Ruth: Relative harm is certainly a very contentious issue. It's true that, in terms of the numbers, alcohol and tobacco always top the charts.
Historically in western culture, alcohol and tobacco have been set apart and you're right to point out the disparity. We would advise caution when using any drug - including alcohol, tobacco, ecstasy, cocaine etc.
Dr Pirate: I'm fairly sensible when using MDMA, I don't tend to drink with it (only sipping water) and occasionally mixing it with a minimal amount of speed. I've come to respect the fact that this drug is having an effect on my system and I'd rather just have that effect, than try to get multiple highs.
Ruth: Sounds very sensible. Take care! :)
cobra: Hi Ruth, my general fear is becoming addicted to drugs and the side effects of them, especially if it's to do with depression. Is there a way to tell if you become too dependent before it becomes fatal?
Ruth: Hi cobra, thanks for your question. It sounds like you're talking about drugs that are prescribed for depression, is that right?
cobra: Yes, I'm going to see a doctor about getting a prescription but I worry about getting too dependent on it, if that makes sense.
Ruth: It varies depending on what type you have been prescribed, not all antidepressants have addictive properties. I'd suggest talking to your GP about your concerns and together you should be able to choose the medication that's right for you. Mind have a really good booklet on antidepressants which is worth a read. And don't worry, you can't die from becoming dependent on antidepressants.
cobra: OK, I'll definitely voice my concerns when I go and see him, and cheers for the link Ruth.
Ruth: I've used several types of antidepressants myself before and I've never found a problem with becoming dependent. Good luck and I hope you feel better soon :)
**helen** : Good stuff Ruth, thanks for your time, some really varied and interesting questions!
Ruth: Thanks everyone for your questions. I've really enjoyed chatting with you all. If you have any further queries feel free to contact info@drugscope.org.uk.
**helen**: Cheerio peeps!
Teagan: Thanks Ruth :)
cobra: Cheers Ruth!
Drugs chat with Ruth from DrugScope
Ruth Goldsmith from DrugScope drops in to answer your questions on mephedrone, cannabis, digital drugs, antidepressants and more.
**helen**: OK, so let's start with a topic that Teagan has raised on the drugs forum.
Teagan: The technology magazine Wired recently published an article about digital drugs - mp3s that induce a state of ecstasy. Apparently this isn't anything new but people are still discovering them. What do you think of them? Are they popular and what are the effects?
Ruth: Hi Teagan, that's a very good question, unfortunately you've stumped me a bit! I haven't heard much about digital drugs but I'll see what I can find out for you. It's not something we've come across at DrugScope.
From what I can see, what's most likely is that people using digital drugs are actually experiencing a placebo effect. They might be listening to digital music with certain types of beat, which could give you a perception of an altered state of mind. However, it doesn't seem as though there's much difference between this type of sound and for example some types of trance music.
rob: I just wanted to know your opinion on the influx of research chemicals coming into the UK. Every time one gets banned another two take its place, they are so accessible to people. Do we need tighter controls over what we allow in the country or should the drugs advisory council work faster? Also, do you think it's as big a problem as the media makes out?
Ruth: Thanks for your question rob. You're absolutely right, since 2009 there has been a significant change in the drug market in the UK since the arrival of mephedrone and its related substances, things like methylone, methadrone and others. It's very hard for the authorities to manage this situation because of the speed with which suppliers are creating new chemicals.
However, the Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs (ACMD) need time to assess the risks posed by each group of substances. They have worked very quickly to ban naphyrone for example.
rob: Yeah, I was impressed by that, but now theres NRG2 and NRG3 and loads of others. It's going to be hard to keep up.
Ruth: I think you're right. In terms of your question about how the media reacts, it's always interesting to watch how the media respond to a new drug scare. However, there are very real concerns about the risk posed by research chemicals because we know so little about them, their short and long term health risks and, what's even scarier, is that you don't always know what you're buying, because labelling may be inaccurate.
rob: I agree totally.
Ruth: You're also right about NRG2 and NRG3 but I would highlight that many of the samples of NRG1 that were tested recently were found to be mephedrone and not naphyrone. This means that you could be buying something that you think is still legal but is now in fact a controlled substance. For a long time, we've said to people who use legal highs that just because something is legal doesn't mean it's safe. And nowadays we need to add that just because you think what you are buying is legal, it doesn't mean it's actually legal. You might be buying something that has a label on it saying one thing, when really, it contains something completely different.
rob: Prohibition didn't work with alcohol, do you not think it would be better to control these substances and educate people when they buy them like the smart shops in Amsterdam? People will always look for a way to get high, it needs to be controlled and just seems so out of control at the moment.
Ruth: I'm speaking on behalf of DrugScope here and we are not a pro-legalisation organisation. However, that doesn't mean we think that there is not room for improvement in the way we deal with the control of drugs.
purplestarfish: What's the deal with cannabis and mental health? There's so much contradictory stuff around.
Ruth: Hi purplestarfish, you're right there is a lot of contradictory stuff around and so far there is no definitive answer to your question. Our advice to everyone is to be careful with cannabis particularly if you are using it heavily and regularly.
People who have existing mental health problems may find that cannabis makes things worse, and there does seem to be some evidence to suggest that for some people cannabis can trigger underlying mental health issues such as psychosis or depression.
purplestarfish: OK then, thanks.
Ruth: If you're concerned about your own or someone elses cannabis use you can find some good online resources to help you manage coming off cannabis, for example on TheSite.org or via Talk to Frank which has a good online programme that you can follow.
purplestarfish: Cool, thanks for that.
Ruth: Does that answer your question purplestarfish?
purplestarfish: Yes.
Dr Pirate: I've not checked on Talk to Frank recently, as I usually use TheSite.org for any drug research, but the "drugs are bad, mmkay" message that was on there when they first launched really deterred me from using that service.
The Captain: So, is Mr Mackay right?
Ruth: Who's Mr Mackay? Are you talking about the guy from South Park?
The Captain: Yup!
Ruth: Well, in answer to your question then, drugs are drugs, it's what you do with them that's important. DrugScope's position is that we neither condemn nor condone drug use.
The Captain: Fair play. Also, is ecstasy more or less dangerous than horse riding? :)
Ruth: So, you've been reading some of Professor Nutts research!
Dr Pirate: I guess that depends on how wild the horse is and how much MDMA you've taken!
Ruth: You can look at this question two ways. You can take the Disraeli position, which is: "Lies, damned lies, and statistics" - i.e. numbers can be used to justify almost any position you choose. Or you can look at it in the way that Professor Nutt has done in some of his research - in terms of raw numbers, it may be true that more people die in the UK each year as a result of riding horses than as a result of taking ecstasy. However this doesn't mean that taking ecstasy is safe.
**helen**: Thanks Ruth. Any more questions guys?
rob: I'm usually quite a quiet person. I read somewhere that diazepam can help social anxiety so I bought some off the net. It really has helped me loads, I feel more confident when talking to people and feel like myself. The problem is I've found I'm taking more and more a day. Is it possible to get addicted to diazepam and if so is it dangerous?
Ruth: Hi rob, I'm sorry to hear that you're having problems with diazepam. It's quite important that you go and see somebody you trust and talk to them about your use of diazepam, ideally your GP.
Diazepam, like other benzodiazepines, is prescribed for people who experience feelings of anxiety or insomnia but they should only be used for a short time. If you have been using them for a long time you may find that you have developed a tolerence to the drugs so you may be tempted to take more to get the same effect.
It is possible to become dependent on these drugs and you should not attempt to stop taking them without medical support. Your GP will keep issues like this confidential and should be able to recommend appropriate sources of support for you. He or she should also help you taper down the dose slowly which will help you come off more easily.
I'm sorry to say that buying your diazepam online is not a great idea. It's possible that you may be buying counterfeit medication, which carries an added risk of contamination or of varying strength.
You can go to the DrugScope website for more info and I have a couple of other useful links: this factsheet on Benzodiazepines and the CITAP website (Council for Information on Tranquillisers, Antidepressants, and Painkillers).
rob: Thanks Ruth, I'll check them out.
Dr Pirate: I was reading on Talk to Frank that "over 200 people" have died due to ecstasy overdoses. How can this be a banned substance, when booze and cigarettes kill thousands every month/year? It's perplexing!
Ruth: Relative harm is certainly a very contentious issue. It's true that, in terms of the numbers, alcohol and tobacco always top the charts.
Historically in western culture, alcohol and tobacco have been set apart and you're right to point out the disparity. We would advise caution when using any drug - including alcohol, tobacco, ecstasy, cocaine etc.
Dr Pirate: I'm fairly sensible when using MDMA, I don't tend to drink with it (only sipping water) and occasionally mixing it with a minimal amount of speed. I've come to respect the fact that this drug is having an effect on my system and I'd rather just have that effect, than try to get multiple highs.
Ruth: Sounds very sensible. Take care! :)
cobra: Hi Ruth, my general fear is becoming addicted to drugs and the side effects of them, especially if it's to do with depression. Is there a way to tell if you become too dependent before it becomes fatal?
Ruth: Hi cobra, thanks for your question. It sounds like you're talking about drugs that are prescribed for depression, is that right?
cobra: Yes, I'm going to see a doctor about getting a prescription but I worry about getting too dependent on it, if that makes sense.
Ruth: It varies depending on what type you have been prescribed, not all antidepressants have addictive properties. I'd suggest talking to your GP about your concerns and together you should be able to choose the medication that's right for you. Mind have a really good booklet on antidepressants which is worth a read. And don't worry, you can't die from becoming dependent on antidepressants.
cobra: OK, I'll definitely voice my concerns when I go and see him, and cheers for the link Ruth.
Ruth: I've used several types of antidepressants myself before and I've never found a problem with becoming dependent. Good luck and I hope you feel better soon :)
**helen** : Good stuff Ruth, thanks for your time, some really varied and interesting questions!
Ruth: Thanks everyone for your questions. I've really enjoyed chatting with you all. If you have any further queries feel free to contact info@drugscope.org.uk.
**helen**: Cheerio peeps!
Teagan: Thanks Ruth :)
cobra: Cheers Ruth!